I was perusing Master Wong’s lovely collection of online videos when I noticed a t’ai chi chin na video in the side bar by Dr. Yang. We’ll get to that in a minute. First a little Yang-style from Master Wong:
In another video Wong talks about Chen-style. I guess this means he’s dabbled in both?
In martial application, Chen-style t’ai chi ch’uan uses a wide variety of techniques applied with all the extremities that revolve around the use of the eight gates of tai chi chuan to manifest either kai (expansive power) or he (contracting power) through the physical postures of Chen forms.
Chen family member Chen Zhenglei has commented that between the new and old frame traditions there are 105 basic fajin methods and 72 basic Qinna methods present in the forms.
Now to Dr. Yang:
I have to admit I’m probably a tad biased here. My former chin na instructor’s lineage is traced back to Dr. Yang. I also have to admit that if there was anyone teaching t’ai chi with martial applications in this area, that’s what I’d train on. Sadly, there are no Chinese martial arts being taught in the Wild Wild West.
I know that there’s a lot of t’ai chi DVDs out there and I’ve half considered ordering one to learn the basics. However, I’ve always viewed DVDs as a supplement to martial arts class, not a substitute.
What do the t’ai chi folks think?
Here’s one that teaches 24-posture and also has narration on the martial applications.
The popular ‘Simplified’ 24-posture form is demonstrated by Master Liang with martial fighting applications. The form is shown from several angles, with breathing instructions. The Standard 48-posture form is also demonstrated.
Money well-spent or a waste of time and money?
-BCP
I was holding off on replying to see if anyone more qualified would say something first, but since they haven’t I’ll give you my opinion, for what it’s worth
I’ve been teaching Chen style taijiquan/tai chi/etc. for 5 years or so, and I always say to my students what you believe about DVDs: you can’t learn taiji from a DVD (or a book). They can be great revision tools, especially at the beginning when you’re not sure what you’re doing, but if you try to learn it solely from a DVD/book I believe you’ll be wasting your time (and money) because you won’t end up learning taiji, you’ll just end up learning a fancy ‘dance’ without any substance.
Taiji is the only martial art I’ve ever done so I can’t say whether this is true for other arts, but in taiji I believe you must have good-quality, hands-on (and I really mean hands-on, physical) corrections from a sensitive teacher who knows what they’re doing – taiji can be so unutterably (and infuriatingly) subtle that you’ll end up missing the important things. The form is taiji, but taiji is not the form (if you see what I mean) – it’s so much more than that, so if you concentrate just on copying a form from a DVD/book you’ll miss out.
It’s a shame you don’t have any taiji teaching near you, Bob, because I’ve thought in the past (I’ve been lurking and reading your blog for years!) that it could be just what you’re looking for, but I definitely wouldn’t advise trying to teach yourself from a DVD.
Wow, I seem to have ended up writing an essay! And feel free to disregard all of the above if you feel like giving it a go anyway
Hope that helped!
Hey Al,
Thanks for weighing in. Yeah, based on my time with chin na that’s what I suspected. I’d probably end up with a moving meditative dance and develop certain things in a bad way.
I guess I’ll keep my eye out for Chinese MA in the area and look forward to starting Krav Maga in a few months.
The first Tai Chi I learned was from a video. It was Terrence Dunn’s Yang Long Form video, to be precise. I learned it and did it to the best of my ability for about a year. Then I sought a teacher.
From the feedback of the teacher and the other students, my time was not wasted. I still had tons to learn, and a lot of that can’t be learned in solo practice. Teachers will accelerate things as well.
Of course, neither that video nor my first teacher did much with specific applications. It was all mostly form practice. I still haven’t had a teacher of tai chi who focused a lot on applications. The do exist, even in the US, but they are exceedingly rare. But there’s something interesting going on with the ones I know about: some teach chin-na, some teach striking (William CC Chen, for example), and some teach shuai-chao (throwing).
In summary, I think the form is worth studying, even if you have only videos to go by. You have some martial experience, try to make use of it, and connect it to what the form is having you do. Illuminate it with videos. Some of that experience will lead you in the wrong way, but if you check in with other people, you will eventually sort that out.
I’ve never learned from anyone in Dr. Yang’s lineage, but all that I have learned suggests he knows a lot, and shares it more than most do.
Like an idiot, I used a handle for my last comment that I use sometimes on gaming blogs , “Toldain”. Don’t know how to edit that.
fixed!
Thanks for your thoughts, Jay.
I keep going back and forth on the video but I may just order it.
During my black belt run in tae kwon do I used two DVDs to supplement my training. This would be new territory.
Who knows? If I do bite on the Krav Maga I may find someone at the school who is also willing to learn the tai chi with me.
Bob