Yesterday I took a day off to play chauffeur for Mrs. Patterson. While she was at a doctor’s appointment I spent in an hour in Borders Books. While there I thumbed through the current issue of Black Belt Magazine. One article in particular caught my eye:
COMBAT HAPKIDO
John Pellegrini, the founder of the reality-based art, teaches three self-defense techniques you can master. Added bonus: watch Pellegrini perform weapon disarms and defenses against lunges and throat grabs.
More from Mr. Wikipedia:
Combat Hapkido’s focus means it has deleted some traditional Hapkido techniques which may be impractical for modern self-defense scenarios . These include aspects such as acrobatic break falls, jump/spinning kicks, forms, meditation, along with the removal of some weapons such as swords and other weapons which would be impractical and not-typically carried around in today’s modern society.
In the article Mr. Pellegrini addresses critics of his art who say its emphasis on grappling, joint locks, and throwing makes it less effective against multiple opponents.
Pellegrini”s response–paraphrased poorly!–states that many of his techniques rely on devastating pressure point tactics. So devastating that a CH practitioner is able to dispatch one opponent and move to the next.
Given that the style apparently has adopted techniques from Jeet Kune Do and Western Boxing, I had to raise an eyebrow at that response. Granted, Pellegrini was confined to a short article and I have absolutely no knowledge of the style’s curriculum. Still if CH’s answer to multiple opponents is hoping for a successful pressure point attack then all I can say is good luck!
If I learned anything in Chin Na it’s that locks, pain compliance, etc. will not always work. There are just too many variables that range from a poorly executed technique to an attacker who is resistant to such techniques.
Both boxing and Jeet Kune Do have better answers to that dilemma — stick and move! Our Chin Na curriculum also had sound advice: if all else fails, punch and kick!
If you want to see some Combat Hapkido in action just visit YouTuber and search for “Combat Hapkido Pellegrini.” That’s exactly how I found this video:
There’s also a really good video at this link.
What stands out for me is how much many of the demonstrated techniques are similar to Chin Na. The only big difference I see is that we mostly lacked the ground work.
Anyhow, still pretty cool stuff!
-BCP
Integrating your comment above about “multiple opponents”, your insight that one’s skill level might mean more than the specific style in terms of its effectiveness; and the debate (in a tab I just closed, but I think it was with “Sue”, about Aikido and “street-effectiveness”):
In the first Aikido school I trained, the instructor often raised applications in terms of multiple assailants. The basic approach was to keep the “controlled” person between you and his buddies, and/or to execute the throw in the general direction of the additional guys.
Also: In Aikido, you (1) know how to take a hard fall, and (2) have a mat to land on. Doing those throws on someone who wasn’t trained to take a fall — and on concrete — would actually do a bit of damage.
But: You have to actually know what you’re doing. I wouldn’t be surprised if Aikido had a steeper learning curve before you reached adequacy, than a style where you just kick ‘n’ punch: a 70% correctly-performed punch would still inflict some damage, whereas a 70% correctly-performed throw may not do **anything**.
–GG
you misunderstand the use of the the term pressure point. This is not a finger poked behind your ear, it refers to an arm bar or a wrist lock. Pressure compliance is one use the other is damage. Any of those techniques used full speed on an unsuspecting opponent would break the limb instantly. i.e. 1 attacker disabled, move to the next. Even a much smaller person can manipulate a joint using leverage as demonstrated by Hoyse Gracie in the early UFC.
Thanks for the feedback Straad!
As I noted in the post, I’m unfamiliar with Combat Hapkido’s actual curriculum. I also agree that most joint lock techniques at full speed would be very devastating.
I will have to disagree with on the term “pressure point”, however. See this link:
“An area on the skin that is highly sensitive to the application of pressure.”
In my long-since-gone PPCT certification days they taught us pressure points as an option for pain compliance and inmate control. A portion of those were like “a finger poked behind your ear.” In fact, that was one of them!
-B
I’m generally weary about arts that feel the need to put ‘combat’, ‘commando’ or any other aggressive sounding epitaph in their title: aren’t all martial arts about fighting and isn’t that their very nature? Sounds like a marketing ploy to me: selling an old art under a new name with only minor modifications so that the unsuspecting public would think it’s the best thing since Bruce Lee. If he has indeed adopted techniques and methods from boxing and JKD that’s great but I do hope that a) he’s actually proficient in them and doesn’t teach his students mistakes and b) he actually gives credit to those arts. I’m all for joint locks: our original style was based on them for about 70% (we modified it to about 50% with a lot more striking) but I seriously wouldn’t recommend using them against multiple opponents unless you can snap the limb in one go (preferably while moving away from the other opponents) or you managed to get one of them into a come-along to use him as a shield. The main problem with this approach is that it usually takes two hands to apply a lock and in that time you are extremely vulnerable to other attacks, especially from the other opponents, since you have no defense left. For multiple opponents I would rely on the most devestating blows I could muster: fingerjabs to the eye, kicks to the groin and especially knees and strikes to the throat. I have the book ‘hapkido’ by 5th degree black belt Marc Tedeshi (http://www.amazon.com/Hapkido-Traditions-Philosophy-Marc-Tedeschi/dp/0834804441/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1287651518&sr=8-1 if you want to check it out) and it deals with strikes to very precise pressure points (pretty much the same ones as used in acupuncture) and they’re supposed to yield ‘devestating results’ but I highly doubt it: even if they actually work it’s almost undoable to accurately target them on a moving opponent and this skill is probably only a possibility for about 0,5% of all hapkido-practioners. To his credit mr. Tedeshi states for general self-defense for those who haven’t trained long it’s probably much better and safer to just stick to striking broad anatomical surfaces (the western approach).
As for the short video above: it looked good but then again it’s easy to make something look good for a demo. One thing I noticed is that he stayed in front of his opponent too much (at least to my taste: I don’t like getting hit because you stayed in someone field of fire and the lock didn’t immidiately put him down) and that he left quite a lot of space between the opponent’s body and his. Then again it’s hard to judge the man on a mere 30 seconds of video.
Hi Zara,
I own that book as well as his book on Tae Kwon Do. IMO these are two of the most well-written and comprehensive books on both topics!
COMBAT A HAPKIDO SCAM
John Pellegrini is the epitome of the phony grandmaster. His claims of 9th degree rank are truly the example what is wrong with the martial arts. The following are facts which are indisputable;
FACT #1:
Pellegrini claims 9th degree rank and Grandmaster In Sun Seo as his instructor. The truth is that In Sun Seo teaches Kuk Sool Won and not Hapkido. Kuk Sool is a sister style similar but not exactly identical to Hapkido. Pellegrini never trained in Kul Sool. He never enrolled, took classes or physically tested in Kuk Sool and his relationship with In Sun Seo is a business relationship, not a documented training relationship. Pellegrini cannot produce an enrollment form, training history, promotion history or black belt ranking in Kuk Sool. His claim to rank is purchasing paper certification from In Sun Seo in return for providing a business relationship involving seminars and the ICHF members also purchasing certification from In Sun Seo.
FACT #2:
Pellegrini has no school. He does not train nor can you train with him. His supposed Federation involves a mail order retail office run by he and his wife. They sell dvd’s, t-shirts, and memberships. There is no school, Pellegrini has not owned a school in decades and when he did, he failed miserably. He can only manage a mail order office, he cannot manage students, a training curriculum or a martial arts school. He survives on retail and mail order sales and also requiring his charter schools to host him for his very basic level Hapkido seminars and political speeches.
FACT #3:
Pellegrini has no standards of training or martial arts ethics. Those without formal Hapkido training can purchase an ICHF Charter and promote without testing or proper credentials. ICHF instructors apply for rank when they decide and there is no physical test of skill or knowledge required. Most often rank is decided over the phone. No belt is presented, no official testing or promotion takes place based on skill in Hapkido. It is a paper and monetary transaction only. Below is a clip from a recent newsletter where Pellegrini is offering a “Sale on Rank certificates”. He is offering his members to come to an event and regardless of their time in grade “If they are within one year” they can purchase their next rank certificate. No testing or proper time in grade needed. When you add up an instructor doing this several times over the course of their blank belt ranking, they can be 3, 4 or 5 years over ranked quite easily. So you have Masters that are not true Masters, 4th and 5th Dans that are not true 4th or 5th dans. No testing needed, no belt issued, skip a year on your next promotion.
PELLEGRINI’S WORDS DIRECT FROM DSI NEWSLETTER:
“If you are due to advance to 5th, 6th, 7th or 7th Dan but are up to one year short of your time in grade, we will waive the time requirement but only for this special occasion ( you must attend the banquet to qualify).”
FACT #4:
Pellegrini cannot demonstrate his own entire curriculum or even a reasonable percentage of it. He cannot demonstrate a Kuk Sool or Hapkido curriculum. He travels around demonstrating the same dozen or so joint locks and delivers alot of political and quasi-patriotic propaganda. When asked about particular concepts, techniques, or requirements at a particular belt or dan level he can never answer the questions or demonstrate the techniques. He is the ultimate phony. If brought before a panel of grandmasters and asked to demonstrate his physical talents and the depths of his knowledge of Hapkido technique he would be ultimately discovered as the phony he is. His biggest fear is all of this information being found out. He has no answers to the above facts. He simply attacks those who bring these facts to light. He has no other defense for the truth.
Ray,
Thanks for weighing in on the topic. I’m really not all that familiar Pellegrini so it’s always good to hear other perspectives.
Best,
Bob
Gentlemen,
Thanks for discussing Combat Hapkido. It’s always healthy to get some perspective. Thanks Bob for starting this off and using your time to open this discussion up.
Ray, there are definitely some interesting comments you made about Grandmaster Pellegrini, but having trained with him and some of his folks over the years and having a very broad spectrum of training with many other masters and styles, I think I might be able to offer some insight as well. I have trained extensively in Hapkido, Systema, Arnis, Jiujitsu, Martial Blade Concepts, Police Defense Tactics, MACP (USACS), Goju-ryu, Silat and many other arts over the past 16 years. I teach professionally and most would consider me pretty open minded.
I do know the Combat Hapkido curriculum very well and currently have a 4th Dan in it an am a regional representative in the ICHF, but don’t let that cloud your judgement of my opinion on the system itself, though. I have seen some Combat Hapkido schools who don’t teach the concepts very well at all, but then again, any art has some poor representatives. As far as Pellegrini, himself, I disagree with many of your assertions. He has in fact trained with GM In Sun Seo who is also the president of the Kido. GM Seo is ultimately a representative for the Korean government for all recognized kwons (32 according the the Kido summit that was held in San Francisco in 2011). Out of all the grandmasters there, Pellegrini was always right next to GM Seo, speaking right after him, and appeared to be his “right hand man”. He has also been trusted with some very important responsibility when it comes to some future events, but you’d have to talk to GM Pellegrini personally to learn what that might be. His place in the Kido must have been earned to place him in such regard in my opinion.
Grandmaster Pellegrini is a very experienced martial artist (Judo, Karate, TKD, Police Defense Tactics, Hapkido, JKD, and Aikido). Having personally worked with him, I can say that he is a very practical, energetic, and influential man who deserves respect. Though some people fault him for his entrepreneurial pursuits and good business sense, he has built a great team and around him with a lot of great abilities. He will be celebrating 20 years of the ICHF in November mostly due to his open-mindedness, hard work, and his cadre. Quality control is difficult when you don’t have a highly mandated and very traditional system. My Combat Hapkido is my own interpretation. That’s okay. Please feel free to ask me any questions concerning this thread.
Thanks!
Locke
I guess I’ll weigh in too. First the article:
To fault one system for not being able to dispatch multiple attackers is to fault all systems. It’s actually a pretty stupid argument to make: “If your system cannot defeat 2 or more people at once then it is a bad system”. And to cite the system’s grappling techniques as the evidence for this is idiotic as well. Particularly because it is ignoring Combat Hapkido’s striking techniques and emphasis on hitting vulnerable targets (eyes, knees, groin, neck, etc) when striking.
Next I’ll address the Ray’s statements about GM Pellegrini:
I’ve met the man, asked questions, been hit by him, been with him at seminars and he was a frequent visitor to my instructor’s Combat Hapkido dojang in Florida. To my skeptic’s eye, the man’s skill is legit, even if he does market his products in a manner that you find disingenuous.
And Zara:
I feel the same way when I see the word “Commando” or “Combat” next to the name of a martial art. However, in this case I can attest to it’s use to simply being a way to differentiate the system from ‘classical’ Hapkido, rather than an attempt to make it appear to be “Teh D3adliest” art on the planet.
-Brett
Kyo –
Thanks for weighing in. This post seems to have taken on a life of it’s own. As I said, I’ve not seen the art in action and was going on what I read in the article and my past experience with related arts. Despite my criticisms (heck I criticize arts that I’ve gotten a black belt in) I’d love to try a flavor of hapkido some day. This would include Pellegrini’s system.
Bob
Hi Bob,
I didn’t misunderstand. I know you were stating it was the original article”s criticism, not necessarily your own. I should have been more clear with to whom my rebuttal was aimed.
For what it’s worth, I too, have some issues with CH but that is a discussion for another venue.
All the best,
-Brett
No worries!
Im a police officer. Ive searched through the years to find the perfect martial art for police work. This art seems to be the best so far in my research. these days and times everything is a liability issue. I have the red belt rank in tae-kwon-do-moodahkwan.you reach up and kick a mans head off and thats your ass! law suit city. its a hard decisio though,because in my experiences you come across guys that are on drugs and they dont feel no pain. Ive had some that dont even react to the tazer.when your fighting drugs,its a losing battle. understand,most martial arts teach you to take the guy out and leave the area. well, we cant. we have to get the guy into custody.anyway combat hapkido seems feasable.
Hi Brian,
Yes, true. Most of what law enforcement is taught centers around what you describe.